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'EXECUTION' MARINE WAS WOUNDED & UNDER STRESS
New York Post ^ | 11/17/04 | Niles Lathem

Posted on 11/16/2004 11:31:37 PM PST by kattracks

WASHINGTON — A U.S. Marine being investigated for allegedly killing an unarmed, wounded Iraqi was acting under extreme combat stress, comrades said yesterday.

It was also disclosed that the Marine had just returned to duty after being shot in the face the previous day.

[snip]

Marines interviewed yesterday said the shooting wasn't a scandal, but evidence of how soldiers react under extreme circumstances.

"I can see why he would do it," said Lance Cpl. Christopher Hanson. "He was probably running around being shot at for days on end in Fallujah. There should be an investigation, but they should look into the circumstances."

"I would have shot the insurgent, too. Two shots to the head," said Sgt. Nicholas Graham, 24, of Pittsburgh. "You can't trust these people. He should not be investigated. He did nothing wrong."

Military sources also noted that the bodies of rebels — and even a beheaded hostage in June — have been booby-trapped with explosives set to go off if touched by an soldier.

A Marine from the same unit as the one in question was reportedly killed the day before the shooting by a booby-trapped body — and the day of the shooting, another Marine was killed by a booby-trapped body.

[snip]

A Pentagon spokesperson said, "The forces we face are not following the standards rules of war. They are using mosques. They are using civilians as human shields and all sorts of other tactics."


(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: banglist; battle; doubletap; execution; fallujah; fallujahmarine; iraq; marine; presstitutes; stress; under; war; warlist; waronterror; was; witchhunt; wounded
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1 posted on 11/16/2004 11:31:38 PM PST by kattracks
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To: kattracks

I'd like to put the idiots at NBC over there and see how long they'd last...


2 posted on 11/16/2004 11:34:36 PM PST by WestVirginiaRebel ("Nature abhors a moron."-H.L. Mencken)
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To: WestVirginiaRebel

Wow, NYPost acutally doing something supporting our troops.


3 posted on 11/16/2004 11:39:05 PM PST by KillerMule
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To: kattracks
Is Kevin Sites still with the Marines?
4 posted on 11/16/2004 11:42:19 PM PST by msnimje
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To: KillerMule

The Post has been very supportive of our troops and of President Bush.


5 posted on 11/16/2004 11:45:07 PM PST by kattracks
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To: kattracks

This just in terrorists are dressing up as imbedded media presstitutes.......

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast." --- Civil War General William Tecumseh Sherman


6 posted on 11/16/2004 11:49:36 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: Squantos

this seal has it about right in my opinion.

http://www.froggyruminations.blogspot.com/

" They're Called Security Rounds

Its a safety issue pure and simple. After assaulting through a target, put a security round in everybody's head. Sorry al-Reuters, there's no paddy wagon rolling around Fallujah picking up "prisoners" and offering them a hot cup a joe, falafel, and a blanket. There's no time to dick around in the target, you clear the space, dump the chumps, and moveon.org. Are Corpsman expected to treat wounded terrorists? Negative. Hey libs, worried about the defense budget? Well, it would be waste, fraud, and abuse for a Corpsman to spend one man minute or a battle dressing on a terrorist, its much cheaper to just spend the $.02 on a 5.56mm FMJ.

By the way, terrorists who chop off civilian's heads are not prisoners, they are carcasses.

UPDATE: Let me be very clear about this issue. I have looked around the web, and many people get this concept, but there are some stragglers. Here is your situation Marine. You just took fire from unlawful combatants shooting from a religious building attempting to use the sanctuary status of their position as protection. But you're in Fallujah now, and the Marine Corps has decided that they're not playing that game this time. That was Najaf. So you set the mosque on fire and you hose down the terrorists with small arms, launch some AT-4s (Rockets), some 40MM grenades into the building and things quiet down. So you run over there, and find some tangos wounded and pretending to be dead. You are aware that suicide martyrdom is like really popular with these kind of idiots, and like taking some Marines with them would be really cool. So you can either risk your life and your fireteam's lives by having them cover you while you bend down and search a guy that you think is pretending to be dead for some reason. Also, you don't know who or what is in the next room, and you're already speaking english to each other and its loud because your hearing is poor from shooting people for several days. So you know that there are many other rooms to enter, and that if anyone is still alive in those rooms, they know that Americans are in the mosque. Meanwhile (3 seconds later), you still have this terrorist that was just shooting at you from a mosque playing possum. What do you do?

You double tap his head, and you go to the next room, that's what.

What about the Geneva Conventions and all that Law of Land Warfare stuff? What about it. Without even addressing the issues at hand you first thought should be, "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6." Bear in mind that this is a perpetual mindset that is reinforced by experiences gained on a minute by minute basis. Secondly, you are fighting an unlawful combatant in a Sanctuary which is a double No No on his part. Third, tactically you are in no position to take "prisoners" because there are more rooms to search and clear, and the behavior of said terrorist indicates that he is up to no good. No good in Fallujah is a very large place and the low end of no good and the high end of no good are fundamentally the same... Marines get hurt or die. So there is no compelling reason for you to do anything but double tap this idiot and get on with the mission.

If you are a veteran then everything I have just written is self evident, if you are not a veteran than at least try to put yourself in the situation. Remember, in Fallujah there is no yesterday, there is no tomorrow, there is only now. Right NOW. Have you ever lived in NOW for a week? It is not easy, and if you have never lived in NOW for longer than it takes to finish the big roller coaster at Six Flags, then shut your hole about putting Marines in jail for war crimes. Be advised, I am not talking to my readers, but if this post gets linked up, I want regular folks to get this message loud and clear. Froggy OUT.

UPDATE #2: See my Prayer for some insight as to how The Big Judge in the sky might rule on this case."


7 posted on 11/16/2004 11:54:39 PM PST by carsonsig
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To: carsonsig

When we started to serch a body for IED's if it wasn't visably dead ie bloated etc we gave a command to show hands and don't move in the native language. Zero response resulted in shots to the head from a safe distance to make sure the enemy was dead !

Sad part is that even though that was SOP for our needs the MSM would still have issues with it as they expect the military to be law enforcement and that just is NOT THE CASE AT ALL.........different job , different mission, ....presstitutes we left in the desert when they were assigned to ride with us. Or I tasked two troops to take em on a Louisana hay ride to let us get the job done. Any way one looks at it the MSM costs the DOD money , lives and initial success. Too bad good officers and NCO's don't know how to "handle" this threat to their troops........


8 posted on 11/17/2004 12:04:04 AM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: WestVirginiaRebel
Rebel, As I read this thread -- and imagined what these marvelous Marines have been going through these past weeks, I could not help but compare their ordeals to Kerry and his contemptible performance in SEA.

Can you imagine that man as POTUS? The mere though send cold chills down my spine.
9 posted on 11/17/2004 12:08:23 AM PST by dk/coro
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To: Squantos
Squantos, in your opinion, if we could somehow stop the reporters from being anywhere near our soldiers, or if they would at least be required to have all their reports, photos and videos security screened by the military before publication, do you think that it would help or would it backfire?

I'm for keeping journalists off the front lines and away from our troops, period. I wonder how many journalists have caused the deaths of others from just being in the way, let alone undoing complete operations, misrepresenting the facts and otherwise being a burden to our soldiers.

10 posted on 11/17/2004 12:19:16 AM PST by bd476 (European leaders: No ETA on their arrival at the nuthouse - they already live there.)
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To: dk/coro
As was portrayed in the movie Saving Private Ryan, compassion on the battlefield can lead to yours or a comrades death.
I also remember seeing a documentary about the battles in the Pacific during WWII that the lack of prisoners for interrogation got so bad that the command was offering a reward for a live Japanese Soldier, since they were a lot like the sand rats we are fighting in Iraq.
11 posted on 11/17/2004 12:20:46 AM PST by Wooly
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To: kattracks
"The forces we face are not following the standards rules of war. They are using mosques. They are using civilians as human shields and all sorts of other tactics."

919. ART. 119. MANSLAUGHTER

(a) Any person subject to this chapter who, with an intent to kill or inflict great bodily harm, unlawfully kills a human being in the heat of sudden passion caused by adequate provocation is guilty of voluntary manslaughter and shall be punished as a court- martial may direct.

--Uniform Code of Military Justice.

Provoked or not, in the heat of passion or not, the Marine in question comitted a crime under the UCMJ which must be duly investigated. As Americans, and especially in the armed services, we do not compromise or otherwise lower our standards. The tactics employed by the enemy do not excuse or exclude our soldiers from the UCMJ and the recognized laws of war.

This is what makes us different from the insurgents, terrorists, and other barbarians that we're fighting in Iraq and elsewhere.

12 posted on 11/17/2004 12:24:19 AM PST by Zeroisanumber
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To: bd476

I think to support the "private enterprise" of MSM imbedded among our troops in battle is wrong. Whos to say the MSM should be the only one to profit from war with nooooze and fabricated outrage to pursue their own political and personal agenda ?

Say if I was some "adventure tours" owner and wanted to send those willing to pay into battle so they too can get a first hand look at the fighting...why would Uncle Sugar pander to the presstitutes and not my enterprise ?

I think the media is a danger to the military operations and as such costing America it's sons and daughters lives .

Too all those that suggest the Military needs to be monitored etc I say BS as the Officers and NCO's appointed over these soldiers sailors airmen and marines are good people and if an atrocity is observed the UCMJ and other directives / policies are in place for just such criminal acts.

Just my opinion of course based on my own personal experience dealing with such stupidity imposed upon me and my troops over my 26 years of service...right or wrong ....mine.

Stay safe !


13 posted on 11/17/2004 12:40:51 AM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: Zeroisanumber

My BP is rising too much so I have to get out of this thread !


14 posted on 11/17/2004 12:43:06 AM PST by america-rules
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To: america-rules

Take her easy.


15 posted on 11/17/2004 12:44:01 AM PST by Zeroisanumber
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To: Zeroisanumber
the Marine in question comitted a crime under the UCMJ which must be duly investigated

So you've decided he's guilty already but it needs to be investigated ?..........how nice. Kinda like if yer suspected witch wrapped in chains sinks she's guilty.....

16 posted on 11/17/2004 12:47:40 AM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: kattracks
In Flanders fields the poppies blow Between the crosses, row on row, That mark our place; and in the sky The larks, still bravely singing, fly Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow, Loved and were loved, and now we lie In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe: To you from failing hands we throw The torch; be yours to hold it high. If ye break faith with us who die We shall not sleep, though poppies grow In Flanders fields.

John McRae

17 posted on 11/17/2004 12:50:10 AM PST by freepatriot32 (http://chonlalonde.blogspot.com)
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To: Squantos
That's a terrific point about free enterprise, Squantos. Hadn't thought of that when reading this story.

There is a website (not sure how I found it) where it appears that there are people who would want to take tour groups to the front lines, just not for journalistic reasons. ;)

I wonder what Constitutional lawyers would say about an emergency prohibition of the press anywhere near our troops just for the safety of the press. It must be difficult when aiming one's weapon or pointing a large barrel with journalists popping in and out of range.

18 posted on 11/17/2004 12:50:14 AM PST by bd476 (European leaders: No ETA on their arrival at the nuthouse - they already live there.)
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To: kattracks
The lesson is, now and always, don't wound terrorists.
19 posted on 11/17/2004 12:50:20 AM PST by spodefly (I've posted nothing but BTTT over 1000 times!!!)
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To: Squantos

I have eyes, I've seen the unedited video, what happened was fairly obvious. What remains is for the Marine to justify his actions.


20 posted on 11/17/2004 12:51:16 AM PST by Zeroisanumber
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